K&C's Focke Wolfe wrong type? (1 Viewer)

[Mitch]

Spitfrnd..

Thanks. Its easy (ish) to tell when someone is being humerous or not and, I am quite dry humoured myself so, sometimes things may not come over as they should but, the important point is that it is benign in its nature. Once you cross the line then You get what you deserve IMO and, its very easy to identify the 'usual culprits' who can then be adequately dealt with.

I can fully understand some manufacturers getting a bit annoyed over critique as they are for all purposes artists who create their ideas and hope that everyone will appreciate them but, from what I have seen most are balanced enough to accept the exacting details collectors want its just unfortunate that some want to twist the knife, so, to speak, and annoy for the sake.
Mitch

You have it quite right Mitch. Stating a fact or even an opinion about anyone's product seems perfectly fine and actually useful. Suggesting that opinion is biased because one collects that brand is on the one hand obvious and on the other irrelevant. Everyone who has some investment is one product line is to some extent naturally biased toward it but their statements of fact, if true, and opinions, if fair, should not be the basis for scorn. Contrary to the suggestions of some, facts really are different than opinion. How the given sculpting or paint of a product is done and how it compares to reality is fact; how that appeals to one or its relative importance is the opinion. IMHO, there would be much less emotional turmoil here if that simple distinction were recognized and if "those who enjoy winding others up" were properly identified and dealt with. Criticism is healthy; unprovoked antagonism and ridicule are not, even when thinly disguised as humor.

 

[HAWKEYE]

hello phantom warrior, i doubt andy would do a he 219 uscha as figarti is probably coming out with one. they had the prototype at chicago last year

 

[Mitch]

Nicely put. Majority of people I have dealt with that do this type of thing seem to wet their pants when confronted. I have come across many and, we call them fifty yard heroes (as thats how far they have to be away from you before they shout abuse)
Mitch

And everyone seems brave when hidden behind a screen name. I often wonder how much of what goes on here would happen face to face? Have there been any punch ups at any of the toy soldiers shows ???

 

[Gazza]

Could someone specify for those of us who are just collectors what the conflict of interest is here? A problem on this forum seems to be determining what is unbiased collector feedback and what is opinion influenced by some direct or indirect relationship with a particular manufacturer. In some cases, there is an allegation that an individual has a connection with a particular manufacturer to discredit their opinion but no evidence is ever presented. I can't think of any reason the specific nature of the relationship should not be disclosed on the forum and let others decide if it has influenced the opinion of the poster. Maybe that has been done here, but I haven't come across it.

Sorry been out enjoying the weather by the pool....

Did anyone respond to this post?

After all 3 people had a bit to say about one forum member earlier on?

 

[tdubel]

Sorry been out enjoying the weather by the pool....

Did anyone respond to this post?

After all 3 people had a bit to say about one forum member earlier on?

I would be happy to respond, I think it is quite obvious with IXEC calling the K&C plane cartoonish while on the K&C thread, then promoting the TG one in the same breath is an example of this is it not? I just must have thrown away all of my years of higher education and just must be an idiot while drawing this conclusion.

Seriously, my bone is not with IXEC or anyone else, it is the manner in which opinions are not posted as opinions, they are posted as baits and barbs against other manufacturers. For crap sake, let the product stand on its own. Like I said before, if a product is well received, it will do well regardless of how someone else's does, that is plain and simple. So when K&C sells its planes and TG does too, who cares???????????????????????????

There is just way too much bitterness posted and most of it is toward K&C, that is plainly obvious. It is posted by a select few who for whatever reason do not like K&C. Again, I just don't understand the anger toward K&C, is it jealousy of success???? And what really puzzles me is why people care??? If you are happy in your own collection, then who cares?

Again, my years of education have failed me in figuring this one out.

On another note, I will be in Chicago this year with a name tag on if anyone cares to look me up. I will be happy to offer my opinions in plain words for anyone to hear if you care (why you would not sure), but they will be readily available and free.

TD

 

[thebritfarmer]

I would be happy to respond, I think it is quite obvious with IXEC calling the K&C plane cartoonish while on the K&C thread, then promoting the TG one in the same breath is an example of this is it not? I just must have thrown away all of my years of higher education and just must be an idiot while drawing this conclusion.

Seriously, my bone is not with IXEC or anyone else, it is the manner in which opinions are not posted as opinions, they are posted as baits and barbs against other manufacturers. For crap sake, let the product stand on its own. Like I said before, if a product is well received, it will do well regardless of how someone else's does, that is plain and simple. So when K&C sells its planes and TG does too, who cares???????????????????????????

There is just way too much bitterness posted and most of it is toward K&C, that is plainly obvious. It is posted by a select few who for whatever reason do not like K&C. Again, I just don't understand the anger toward K&C, is it jealousy of success???? And what really puzzles me is why people care??? If you are happy in your own collection, then who cares?

Again, my years of education have failed me in figuring this one out.

On another note, I will be in Chicago this year with a name tag on if anyone cares to look me up. I will be happy to offer my opinions in plain words for anyone to hear if you care (why you would not sure), but they will be readily available and free.

TD

A great post Tom! although I am sure in a few months you'll be posting the same again.

I ask this question of our collectors:-

So if a K&C piece is "crap" and you have no intention of buying it and never had why all the fuss?

 

[Northgate Woods]

Tom mate,
Great post my young Johnny Reb. I could not have said it better. You better get me one of them there name tags and I will stand beside you and "watch you back". Snipers and back stabbers could be around.
Cheers Howard

 

[Combat]

I still don't see any explanation as to the specific relationship between IXEC and TGM.

 

[Spitfrnd]

Actually while I respect and like Tom, I am not so sure his post completely hit the mark and the reasons why are rather important so here are a few thoughts.

I would be happy to respond, I think it is quite obvious with IXEC calling the K&C plane cartoonish while on the K&C thread, then promoting the TG one in the same breath is an example of this is it not? I just must have thrown away all of my years of higher education and just must be an idiot while drawing this conclusion.

I am sorry but while I find the word "cartoonish" unnecessarily confrontational, I don't see the conflict any more than as I noted earlier for every collector that has a substantial commitment to any producer. If that is his honest opinion, why does it bother anyone?

Seriously, my bone is not with IXEC or anyone else, it is the manner in which opinions are not posted as opinions, they are posted as baits and barbs against other manufacturers. For crap sake, let the product stand on its own. Like I said before, if a product is well received, it will do well regardless of how someone else's does, that is plain and simple. So when K&C sells its planes and TG does too, who cares???????????????????????????

I agree about the baits and barbs but some differentiation is needed. Critical comments about mistakes or level of detail or accuracy are not baits and not barbs either unless they are stated in a condescending or combative tone. Yes we have plenty examples of that here but we also have plenty of plain comment that is treated the same and that is simply not helpful.

There is just way too much bitterness posted and most of it is toward K&C, that is plainly obvious. It is posted by a select few who for whatever reason do not like K&C. Again, I just don't understand the anger toward K&C, is it jealousy of success???? And what really puzzles me is why people care??? If you are happy in your own collection, then who cares?....

Yes there is too much bitterness but I must beg to differ that it is mostly against K&C or even about any manufacturer. They are some here, as there are in most large groups, that don't know or care how to be civil or have rational interactions with others. It is not about jealousy of success, who collects what or anything more than simple antisocial behavior and the anonymity of this vehicle makes it worse (the 50 yard issue if you will). That is a pity but the more it is rewarded or excused, the worse it will be. It is possible to relish one's collection without demeaning those of others, just as it is possible to be critical without being demeaning. All of us face that challenge every day so why not practice it here? A little understanding and politeness goes a long way, no matter what you collect.

 

[jazzeum]

Tom mate,
Great post my young Johnny Reb. I could not have said it better. You better get me one of them there name tags and I will stand beside you and "watch you back". Snipers and back stabbers could be around.
Cheers Howard

Ditto to what Howard said.

 

[IXEC]

I still don't see any explanation as to the specific relationship between IXEC and TGM.

There is none.....it's, seemingly, simple paranoia...

Tom Gunn has felt the need, he's told me, to go so far as to PM members here, to tell them, himself, there is NO relationship.......and I know to whom he gave this message. These informed, know who they are here, but they still insist on beating the drum, to claim otherwise

Judging from their multiple comments....I seem to possess some rather remarkable powers of foresight....Had I known, I'm gifted as such, surely I would have won the Lottery, before now....

End of story.........or is it.....

IXEC

 

[wayne556517]

There is none.....it's, seemingly, simple paranoia...

Tom Gunn has felt the need, he's told me, to go so far as to PM members here, to tell them, himself, there is NO relationship.......and I know to whom he gave this message. These informed, know who they are here, but they still insist on beating the drum, to claim otherwise

Judging from their multiple comments....I seem to possess some rather remarkable powers of foresight....Had I known, I'm gifted as such, surely I would have won the Lottery, before now....

End of story.........or is it.....

IXEC

Or is it.....................

 

[jazzeum]

There is none.....it's, seemingly, simple paranoia...

Tom Gunn has felt the need, he's told me, to go so far as to PM members here, to tell them, himself, there is NO relationship.......and I know to whom he gave this message. These informed, know who they are here, but they still insist on beating the drum, to claim otherwise

Judging from their multiple comments....I seem to possess some rather remarkable powers of foresight....Had I known, I'm gifted as such, surely I would have won the Lottery, before now....

End of story.........or is it.....

IXEC

Yes, and I have a bridge in Brooklyn that I'd like to sell you

 

[IXEC]

Yes, and I have a bridge in Brooklyn that I'd like to sell you

Some would think that, a rather odd comment for a councilor to make ....

If guilt by association....covers it for you....so be it..

 

[tdubel]

Let me add one thing.

All 3 planes look good to me.

I know Andy well and respect his product as well as call him a friend. He has always had an open door so to speak and he is just plain fun to hang out with and discuss this hobby. He has earned or should have by now collector's respect. His constant drive and output each month is unbelievable to a toy soldier collector. I speak from 32 years of experience. I am 37 now and have collected since the age of 5 and still have every piece from my childhood.

Now, TG, also a very nice guy to discuss the hobby with. I took umbrage to a stance he took in the beginning, however, I have since had a very nice relationship with TG and I can't complain one iota about him. The products stand on their own and are great additions to the hobby.

SO, conclusion, what on green earth is the problem??? The problem is back to the meat of my post. Barbs and baits have gotten old, I gave up giving my opinion (critical ones) b/c all it turned into was BS. I was labeled as picking on a manufacturer.

Let me provide one final insight. I buy what I like, however, if I do not like the person making the product.............I don't buy it. That is my perogative and choice, to each his own.

So, anyhow, free opinions given at chicago, just look me up.

Tom

 

[OzDigger]

There is none.....it's, seemingly, simple paranoia...

Tom Gunn has felt the need, he's told me, to go so far as to PM members here, to tell them, himself, there is NO relationship.......and I know to whom he gave this message. These informed, know who they are here, but they still insist on beating the drum, to claim otherwise

Judging from their multiple comments....I seem to possess some rather remarkable powers of foresight....Had I known, I'm gifted as such, surely I would have won the Lottery, before now....

End of story.........or is it.....

IXEC

I still don't see any explanation as to the specific relationship between IXEC and TGM.

Ixec often posts photos of TGM models well before their release which gave me the impression that he does have some specific relationship with the company, maybe other members have also noticed this and came to the same conclusion (Right or Wrong).

 

[Mitch]

Really the point of the matter is that I am sure everyone is now sick and tired of it. If Ixec knows TG and gets pics soon but, is not mature enough to come out and say it... so, be it if not, then he gets photo's sent early again, quite lucky but, stuff is posted on the in sculpt part of the web and sent to dealers early so, again, who cares??.

If everyone acted correctly and stop all the child like games and daft, mine is better than yours then we really could just get down to discussing what we are on here for and not trying to either get one over someone for some short lived internet triumph or to big up certain manufacturers.

This post should be ended by the moderators hastily

Just my opinion
Mitch

 

[Mister Dave]

I am concerned that the creator of this thread is being villified unjustifiably here. Reading his first and subsequent 2-3 posts from June 2nd, it looks like pretty straightforward technical concerns are being aired about this piece from a guy who obviously knows a heck of a lot about aircraft.

MD

 

[Spitfrnd]

I am concerned that the creator of this thread is being villified unjustifiably here. Reading his first and subsequent 2-3 posts from June 2nd, it looks like pretty straightforward technical concerns are being aired about this piece from a guy who obviously knows a heck of a lot about aircraft.

MD

Very correct Dave but like some of the rest of us here, you may be PITW.

 

[tdubel]

I am concerned that the creator of this thread is being villified unjustifiably here. Reading his first and subsequent 2-3 posts from June 2nd, it looks like pretty straightforward technical concerns are being aired about this piece from a guy who obviously knows a heck of a lot about aircraft.

MD

Dont agree, I think what (in my mind) is being vilified and justly I might add are posts that are blatant barbs and baits and there is not one person (in my posts) being vilified unjustly. I just happened to use 1 example that referenced one person b/c it was available.

Technical points are quite justified and worth asking about. Blatant attacks and disrespect are not. Therein lies the rub, which is which is hard to identify, but when the same drum gets beaten over and over it is easier to identify such barbs.

I guess a good rule is don't post something you wouldnt say to someone in person, that generally keeps the disputes to a minimum.

Tom