Leave K&C Alone... (2 Viewers)

[Desertkiwi]

Are you sure he can see your reply !!!

.....I don't think he's quite worked that one out yet Brett......give it time mate, he still hasn't answered my question yet......

 

[Firebat]

WOW....... A member on another thread who states he is a stickler for detail has relaxed his stance on the hobby and he has learned to embrace the flaws we are discussing. So if this is the way the hobby is going, and it seems it is, because most seem to support being forgiving as far as tolerating product flaws and paying a ton of money for these flaws.

My time in this hobby will definately be growing short.

We almost made it, products are getting better, but I guess with the support of forgiving fans the manufacturers will have no motivation to respond to the issues.

So many will go to Chicago, tip beers, discuss the future of the hobby, listen to empty motivational speeches and say the manufacturer presidents are great guys, yet the products will continue to be inferior and the prices will continue to go up.

Cant beat this horse any more, we all have to make our choices and enjoy some hobby ...I think I have found my true enjoyment in the super detailed and fair priced HO Trains.



HMMMMMM...Actually 1/87th scale ( HO scale ) has excellent detailed military vehicles by Roco and a few other manufacturers. I have a ton of them packed away. I think I will break them out.

I am glad I saw this thread my hobby mind is slowly changing as this discussion progresses. I think I am starting to find my hobby home.

Alex

 

[Mitch]

Alex...

You just won the 1st prize teddy bear at the show!!! Only a few manufacturers actually listen accept and take on board what is said and change the products. Just focus on those ones
Mitch

WOW....... A member on another thread who states he is a stickler for detail has relaxed his stance on the hobby and he has learned to embrace the flaws we are discussing. So if this is the way the hobby is going, and it seems it is, because most seem to support being forgiving as far as tolerating product flaws and pthere is little motivation aying a ton of money for these flaws.

My time in this hobby will definately be growing short.

We almost made it, products are getting better, but I guess with the support of forgiving fans the manufacturers will have no motivation to respond to the issues.

So many will go to Chicago, tip beers, discuss the future of the hobby, listen to empty motivational speeches and say the manufacturer presidents are great guys, yet the products will continue to be inferior and the prices will continue to go up.

Alex

 

[Jack]

WOW....... A member on another thread who states he is a stickler for detail has relaxed his stance on the hobby and he has learned to embrace the flaws we are discussing. So if this is the way the hobby is going, and it seems it is, because most seem to support being forgiving as far as tolerating product flaws and paying a ton of money for these flaws.

My time in this hobby will definately be growing short.

We almost made it, products are getting better, but I guess with the support of forgiving fans the manufacturers will have no motivation to respond to the issues.

So many will go to Chicago, tip beers, discuss the future of the hobby, listen to empty motivational speeches and say the manufacturer presidents are great guys, yet the products will continue to be inferior and the prices will continue to go up.

Cant beat this horse any more, we all have to make our choices and enjoy some hobby ...I think I have found my true enjoyment in the super detailed and fair priced HO Trains.

HMMMMMM...Actually 1/87th scale ( HO scale ) has excellent detailed military vehicles by Roco and a few other manufacturers. I have a ton of them packed away. I think I will break them out.

Alex

Alex

Who are you referring to when you say 'we'? If you believe most people are forgiving of the flaws maybe that is the feedback that the manufacturers are listening to. Being in a minority does not mean you are wrong but if as you say most people (and I suppose I fit into that category) are not interested in 'improvements' why should a collector like me cough up more money so an exhaust pipe is the right length or the colour on the wheels is consistent with the tone used in the summer of 1943? If your view that the majority of collectors 'seem to support being forgiving as far as tolerating product flaws and paying a ton of money for these flaws' is correct why should things change to suit a minority? I have no idea what the majority view is as I move in a small circle of collectors but I am happy to accept your assessment that few seem to think there is a problem. Swimming against the tide cannot be fun even if you are right but you are fighting for a cause that you have acknowledged is not a popular uprising.

These are just my thoughts based on a ridiculously small sample but if my view is the majority view, all the better for me!

Jack

 

[Firebat]

Good point.......I guess majority rules ...HO Trains here I come :wink2:

 

[waynepoo]

Alex

Who are you referring to when you say 'we'? If you believe most people are forgiving of the flaws maybe that is the feedback that the manufacturers are listening to. Being in a minority does not mean you are wrong but if as you say most people (and I suppose I fit into that category) are not interested in 'improvements' why should a collector like me cough up more money so an exhaust pipe is the right length or the colour on the wheels is consistent with the tone used in the summer of 1943? If your view that the majority of collectors 'seem to support being forgiving as far as tolerating product flaws and paying a ton of money for these flaws' is correct why should things change to suit a minority? I have no idea what the majority view is as I move in a small circle of collectors but I am happy to accept your assessment that few seem to think there is a problem.

These are just m thoughts based on a ridiculously small sample but if my view is the majority view, all the better for me!

Jack

Yes you do move in a small circle of collectors but what a discerning, intelligent and tolerant circle it is..(even Phil) ^&grin:rolleyes2:
Wayne.

 

[barneywomble]

Hi everyone... I have been very very busy working for the past couple of weeks so I have missed all of this action.... that said, I did manage to pop over to my local toy store today to pick up my new field grey DEMAG... I eagerly raced home after work and opened the box.... wow was I disappointed... the white polystyrene foam just didn't look the correct shade of white to me.... I know Andy has a lot on his plate ensuring the accuracy of the models he produces but surely we can get some consistency in the polystyrene.... I'm a collector after all.... {sm4}^&grin

living the dream... and loving it...

Marc

 

[Rutledge]

I guess I am in the minority here but I consider these toys a kind of artwork and therefore subject to the creator's interpretation. Accuracy matters, to a degree, yes, but not to the nth degree. I recall where FL recently got the chevrons upside down on the American paratroops. That may have been a bridge too far for me in terms of non-accuracy.

Regardless, I dont ever "justify" my collection by saying Im sort of historian and just trying to preserve the record or some such. Nope, these are toy soldiers, and I appreciate the artistry, creativity and skill that goes into each piece.

Those who want to raise a stink about what 99.9% of the world would never notice, well, whatever. Its a hobby, thats it. There is no grander meaning to it, nor is there a "responsibility" owed by the K&Cs of the world. They arent teachers of young minds, or stewards of the past. The TS makers are simply businessmen with an artistic sense who manufacture a product that a few goofy adults enjoy.

My two cents.

 

[Dragoon]

Wow! Truly amazing. Someone new comes onto this forum and within their first few posts manages to toss a grenade right into the fuel depot. Well over 100 replies to this thread with I'm sure more happy hijinks to follow.

 

[Firebat]

Maybe I can end it here:

There are the tolerant and the intolerant.

The tolerant are OK with everything as it stands and appear to be the majority.

AND.... The intolerant can keep on complaining or pack our bags and leave.


As an intolerant I find that bucking the establishment is not fun and I dont particularly like these discussions.

Mitch said a while back there are certain manufacturers who are close to doing the right thing, so as an intolerant you can dabble selectively....... or as I said us intolerants can get out and save everyone a lot of grief.


I am currently hanging in the balance. I am definitely cutting back.

 

[Rob]

Would be a sad day on this forum if folk who appreciate accuracy and authenticity felt they were unable to voice their concerns, I dont think and certainly hope no one wants that Alex.:smile2:

Rob

Maybe I can end it here:

There are the tolerant and the intolerant.

The tolerant are OK with everything as it stands and appear to be the majority.

AND.... The intolerant can keep on complaining or pack our bags and leave.


As an intolerant I find that bucking the establishment is not fun and I dont particularly like these discussions.

So as Mitch said a while back there are certain manufacturers who are close to doing the right thing, so you can dabble selectivly or as I said get out.


I am currently hanging in the balance.

 

[Firebat]

Would be a sad day on this forum if folk who appreciate accuracy and authenticity felt they were unable to voice their concerns, I dont think and certainly hope no one wants that Alex.:smile2:

Rob

I appreciate your tolerance...But is not the general cry that many are sick and tired of these discussions. Alex

 

[jberto18]

This may be a hot button topic but I don't see what the general argument is here (which is why I will continue to lightheartedly post GIFs). If you like the product buy it, if you don't then don't buy it.

If you notice an issue make it a historical discussion and not a pee-pee contest over who is right/wrong.

If you have suggestions as to what K&C could do to make the product better or more interesting then voice that suggestion - but don't blame the company for general historical malfeasance.

Why can't we just oooh and aaah over each other's dios and brainstorm ideas that make the hobby interesting?

Cheers,

JBerto

 

[bradleyl30]

I appreciate the discussions on accuracy. My interest in military history, combined with the fond remembrances of playing with toy soldiers as a kid sparked my interest in this hobby.

Too me it seems that it takes two to tango (I actually prefer 'there are two a******* in every argument, but that would be inappropriate), and that those of us who appreciate the discussions on accuracy get pummeled by those who think we are counting rivets. And that often, those of us who are concerned about accuracy comment on it at times when it is not appreciated or necessary.

So, I think each of us need to ask ourselves very carefully if our comments are constructive or inflammatory and respect both the "military historian" and the "just having fun" mode of collecting.

Issues of scale and accuracy as I was 'going it alone' actually helped me discover this forum. Listening to both sides of the issue have helped me reduce the problems and not take them so seriously at the same time.

 

[bzr116]

In the spirit of not taking things too seriously

 

[Desertkiwi]

I appreciate your tolerance...But is not the general cry that many are sick and tired of these discussions. Alex

I think you'll find Alex, it's not what is being said, it's how it's being said and by who..........say it once, say it well and move on.....it really is that easy!!

I think you'll find most members are very tolerant and are more than happy to discuss stuff......it's when we all hear the same moans and groans from the same .05% that folks get cranky, especially when that horse has been well and truly 'flogged to death'... and I mean flogged. beaten, bashed, jumped on, kicked to the point the glue factory is now full.

Personally I'm concerned that this endless ranting 'darkens' some very good threads and puts members off, particularly the new ones.

By all means voice an opinion, but leave the boring stuff at home.

Cheers!{sm4}

 

[PanzerAce1944]

Time to get back to enjoying the Hobby and enjoying everyones new acquisitions and Diorama's ........:wink2:

 

[Mitch]

seems like people get cranky etc and have been for many years in the K&C section. funny that it seems to be a 0.5% year after year. I have heard it takes two a number of times!! funny the alleged 0.5% are always wrong and this alleged larger group never do anything??? Perhaps the respect etc that Rob keeps telling the forum lately is not getting through to all. Its like the see no evil, hear no evil, and allegedly say no evil.

As long as there are issues with the releases there will be discussions. quite simple make a section where people who wish to discuss the scale, detail, and accuracy of releases can discuss the releases from manufacturers. Those who don't wish to can then open a thread and say how wonderful it is should they wish.
Mitch

 

[Rob]

Fault on both sides Mitch, nobody wants to stifle fair criticism and nobody wants to see those enjoying the hobby made to feel like they are stupid for buying what they please. Pete summed it up best waaaaaaaaaay back.

Time to move on I reckon.

Rob

 

[uksubs]

I'm away on holiday but what I fine funny all the people moaning Keep coming back posting the same old stuff that been said over and over again it boring subject instead of posting photos of the KC diorama say it all !Let get back to talking about toy soldiers next month going to be a great month but not for my bank account .