"Refugees on the Road" (4 Viewers)

[uksubs]

I do not see any captured soldiers in the refugee group. That's what we are talking about.

This is what you posted
[QUOTE=jbonzo1;
Then please explain to me why they do not have the Star of David armbands???
THAT would make them "spot on", mate.

 

[Mitch]

SteveDavid.....

Without keeping this thread going forever can you please explain to me when we crossed the boundaries of the toy soldier hobby and, who set them and, who they were that they could impose such conditions on what many thousands of collectors and manufaturers buy or sell?

It seems to me a sad feature of our society when many are restricted and villified for not adhering to the alleged 'norm' because they hold different opinions.

I think we may find that in chapter 1 of any history books will inform us that this is how the seeds of totalitarianism rose.

Its not a dig but, I am very interested
Mitch

 

[Mister Dave]

Admittedly some fairly nice looking figures here, but surely by any reasonable standards, as presented here, this is utterly tasteless I'm afraid.

MD

 

[Sahara]

Really this has gotten a little out of hand. I see no problem with the way this photo was portrayed. Like Andy said if you don't like it don't buy it. Is there really much more of a difference then this set from Egypt?

or is it that WWII is a little more recent and some don't find the the Egyptian set as offensive? Fact of the matter is War is a horrible thing. I think each and everyone of us takes pleasure in seeing companies produce more realistic products. Unfortunately this was part of war and wether you like it or not it did happen. Now as a collector you can come to your own conclusions as to what is really happening in this scene but please leave it to the imagination of the collector. I for one like this photo the way it is laid out and will not jump to the conclusion that these are "Jewish" being hauled off to a concentration camp.

 

[jules118]

Sorry folks, I know that I am relatively new here and maybe not 'experienced' enough in this forum to let spray, but...

Geezus guys! Cut the hypocrisy! Some of us will quite happily create our little fantasy scenes of violence, brutality and senseless death & destruction with our figures then say a column of civilians being photographed is tasteless.

It seems to me like the armchair generals want to pretend that it's all a heroic between equally armed and skilled opponents on a level playing field... and where everybody gets up and goes home afterwards. WAR is tasteless and all of us would/could be accused of being tasteless in our glorification of it.

And don't give me that BS about honoring those that served etc. As an ex Special Forces soldier, I'd rather see the memory of the few mates that I have lost (or are struggling with PTSD issues) honored by somebody donating the cash that they would otherwise spend on K&C to a charity organisation like Legacy (which looks after the wives & kids of deceased servicemen here in Oz) than buying model soldiers.

The civilians that K&C have released, plus the scene set up in the photo are a fact of life ... things like that happened. You can choose to include them in your set up or not ... but don't try and tell me that setting up a diorama where one 'human' is killing or preparing to kill another 'human' is a depiction of anything less reprehensible or disgusting.

Good work, Andy, carry on

 

[SteveDavid]

Mich,

having read your post 58 where you compare atrocities of the allied vs the Germans, I prefer, with all due respect not to respond to your question - I would collect so many infraction points that I would be banned for life here!

It has nothing to do with morale, but with decency.

So as always, I take the opportunity not to buy.

And this is not a dig either.

 

[Simpson & his donkey.]

Oh I could have some fun here but I will refrain to only say I like the figures and will pick out the ones I like and buy them. They would look great in a london blitz diorama. Simmo.

 

[Rob]

Sorry folks, I know that I am relatively new here and maybe not 'experienced' enough in this forum to let spray, but...

Geezus guys! Cut the hypocrisy! Some of us will quite happily create our little fantasy scenes of violence, brutality and senseless death & destruction with our figures then say a column of civilians being photographed is tasteless.

It seems to me like the armchair generals want to pretend that it's all a heroic between equally armed and skilled opponents on a level playing field... and where everybody gets up and goes home afterwards. WAR is tasteless and all of us would/could be accused of being tasteless in our glorification of it.

And don't give me that BS about honoring those that served etc. As an ex Special Forces soldier, I'd rather see the memory of the few mates that I have lost (or are struggling with PTSD issues) honored by somebody donating the cash that they would otherwise spend on K&C to a charity organisation like Legacy (which looks after the wives & kids of deceased servicemen here in Oz) than buying model soldiers.

The civilians that K&C have released, plus the scene set up in the photo are a fact of life ... things like that happened. You can choose to include them in your set up or not ... but don't try and tell me that setting up a diorama where one 'human' is killing or preparing to kill another 'human' is a depiction of anything less reprehensible or disgusting.

Good work, Andy, carry on

Would not matter if it was your first post my friend,its a free forum and you are allowed to put your opinion!

And now if its ok I'll disagree with (part of)it If anyone on this forum sees their collection as 'honouring ' ' Paying tribute ' or anything else they feel, then its entirely up to them and I'm guessing not ' BS ' to them.Lots of people remember in lots of differing ways,some wear the Poppy,some read books,some watch films and maybe some collect TS's.

Its one of the things that make this hobby very interesting,the huge diversity of viewpoints, loyalties and areas of interest. We all have to make our own decisions about what we collect and when.

I like these refugee figures myself.And its another one of those releases that becomes part of a Jigsaw.What I mean by that is that I've been thinking how I could use the ruined Church, now with the addition of refugees and the Ambulance ,FOB British figures it completes a picture.Civilians are the unsung heroes of war and its good they are recognised by K&C like this, and as is often said in dispatches, they can be used in a variety of theaters and situations ,what we do and don't do with them is entirely up to us!

Rob

 

[King & Country]

To: Treefrog Forum
Re: “Refugees on the Road”

Hi Guys,

Re “Mr. Dave’s” comments… “But surely by any reasonable standards, as presented here, this is utterly tasteless I’m afraid”.
Well, my friend, most of the posters on this thread and, of course, yours truly, must, by your definition, be outside the “reasonable standards” boundary.

Like our other friend, “UK Subs”, you seem determined to put a negative slant on this one photo. With him of course all roads (especially refugee ones) seem to lead to Concentration Camps!!!

For the record Goebells and his propaganda ministry loved to photograph and film German or Volksdeutsch civilians being driven from their homes or standing, looking bewildered after what they called the “terror bombing” by RAF Bomber Command or the US 8th. Air Force.

K&C purposely designed these figures to fit in with a wide variety of WW2 scenarios on both sides of the war… the Campaign in Poland… the Fall of France and the Low Countries… Operation Barbarossa… Arnhem… the defeat of Germany… and many more.

The fact is some of you guys cannot see beyond your own prejudices and preconceptions (or is that misconceptions)… and you don’t want to either.

Now, is that reasonable enough for you… or am I just being utterly tasteless again!!!

Love ‘n’ kisses all round,
Andy C.

 

[The Military Workshop]

Group hug !!!

 

[Rob]

To: Treefrog Forum
Re: “Refugees on the Road”

Hi Guys,

Re “Mr. Dave’s” comments… “But surely by any reasonable standards, as presented here, this is utterly tasteless I’m afraid”.
Well, my friend, most of the posters on this thread and, of course, yours truly, must, by your definition, be outside the “reasonable standards” boundary.

Like our other friend, “UK Subs”, you seem determined to put a negative slant on this one photo. With him of course all roads (especially refugee ones) seem to lead to Concentration Camps!!!

For the record Goebells and his propaganda ministry loved to photograph and film German or Volksdeutsch civilians being driven from their homes or standing, looking bewildered after what they called the “terror bombing” by RAF Bomber Command or the US 8th. Air Force.

K&C purposely designed these figures to fit in with a wide variety of WW2 scenarios on both sides of the war… the Campaign in Poland… the Fall of France and the Low Countries… Operation Barbarossa… Arnhem… the defeat of Germany… and many more.

The fact is some of you guys cannot see beyond your own prejudices and preconceptions (or is that misconceptions)… and you don’t want to either.

Now, is that reasonable enough for you… or am I just being utterly tasteless again!!!

Love ‘n’ kisses all round,
Andy C.

Andy,thought I might try some of these figures in a London Blitz scenario too,now all I need is ARP,Police,Home Guard.....

Rob

 

[The Military Workshop]

and an EOD team defusing an unexploded bomb.

 

[Mitch]

SteveDavid...

That is your right. If you wish you could PM me to save 'being banned' as my post which, you alude only stated that their as always is two sides to every atrocity so, to speak.

Perhaps you could without fear of being banned tell me who sets these boundaries we apparantly have transgressed?

The fact that a few on here have stated that one diorama scene by Mr Neilson immediately brings to mind for some a german atrocity and, that picture represents nothing sinister or worse than you could see on the BBC news.

Without response it does seem that it is beyond decency and more towards morality and certain sections believing their brand is correct and anything other is an afront.

As for post 58 my whole point was that in hindsight of events, regardless, a 'victors' war crime is still a war crime and, I mentioned a couple as it seemed some where insinuating that crimes were only perpetrated by the Axis.
Mitch

 

[Mister Dave]

Really this has gotten a little out of hand. I see no problem with the way this photo was portrayed. Like Andy said if you don't like it don't buy it. Is there really much more of a difference then this set from Egypt?

or is it that WWII is a little more recent and some don't find the the Egyptian set as offensive? Fact of the matter is War is a horrible thing. I think each and everyone of us takes pleasure in seeing companies produce more realistic products. Unfortunately this was part of war and wether you like it or not it did happen. Now as a collector you can come to your own conclusions as to what is really happening in this scene but please leave it to the imagination of the collector. I for one like this photo the way it is laid out and will not jump to the conclusion that these are "Jewish" being hauled off to a concentration camp.

Sorry to have ruffled some feathers, but I honestly don't think I've been overly sensitive in this case. If you could not comfortably set this scene up in your home and show it to your mother in law, your Granny, your boss and co-workers or your young children and/or grand-children then I suspect you may be harboring some of this discomfort yourselves. I promise, no more harping from me on this subject.

MD

 

[Cornwallis]

Great figures, I think you WWII collectors are getting spoiled now with civilians, us poor old AWI collectors haven't had new soldier for over a year!

Seriously though civilians from all eras I'm sure would be welcomed by us collectors!

 

[Guy]

Hi,
I found an original picture of belgian refugees on the road in 1940 fleeing for the advancing german armies.I will mail it tomorrow,you will see that the K&C figurines match perfectly in this picture.The resemblance with the real situation of 70 years ago is striking;
Guy

 

[fmethorst]

I'm really surprised at some of the conclusions people have jumped to from a picture of refugees being photographed/filmed by what appears to be German P.K.men. You'd think this was a scene from a Polish ghetto and these guys were filming "Der ewige Jude".

We have no idea what nationality/race/religion the refugee figures represent because they are generic. Unless you guys are inferring from their dress or physical appearance that they look like the victims of the Nazi regime I'm at a loss to understand all the fuss. As Andy already noted these could be Germans fleeing the advancing Soviets.

 

[RoughRider]

These pieces are pretty generic. They are anything but offensive. I am personally happy to see pieces that allow us to expand the realism of our dioramas.

 

[Phantom Warrior]

As I have said before, while the refugee figures are generic, Andy has made them accurate enough and given them a lot of character so the pieces could stir up uncomfortable images in the minds of some people. And it looks like it has.

Terry

 

[damian]

To: Treefrog Forum
Re: “Refugees on the Road”

Hi Guys,

Re “Mr. Dave’s” comments… “But surely by any reasonable standards, as presented here, this is utterly tasteless I’m afraid”.
Well, my friend, most of the posters on this thread and, of course, yours truly, must, by your definition, be outside the “reasonable standards” boundary.

Like our other friend, “UK Subs”, you seem determined to put a negative slant on this one photo. With him of course all roads (especially refugee ones) seem to lead to Concentration Camps!!!

For the record Goebells and his propaganda ministry loved to photograph and film German or Volksdeutsch civilians being driven from their homes or standing, looking bewildered after what they called the “terror bombing” by RAF Bomber Command or the US 8th. Air Force.

K&C purposely designed these figures to fit in with a wide variety of WW2 scenarios on both sides of the war… the Campaign in Poland… the Fall of France and the Low Countries… Operation Barbarossa… Arnhem… the defeat of Germany… and many more.

The fact is some of you guys cannot see beyond your own prejudices and preconceptions (or is that misconceptions)… and you don’t want to either.

Now, is that reasonable enough for you… or am I just being utterly tasteless again!!!

Love ‘n’ kisses all round,
Andy C.

Actually we are all waiting for the Anne Frank personality figure.