American Civil War.... (4 Viewers)

[Vezzolf]

Thanks Frank,its always a worry when you start a new collection with a new supplier that it won't be around long enough for you to finish,but this does not sound like it will be an issue,thanks again

Rob

Rob,I don't think this will be a problem....Hopefully Matt will...."re-release"..... items that are in demand....Seconday markets have ruined the enjoyment of this hobby IMO.....I sincerely hope that First Legion will give their followers what they want and produce product in sufficient quantity so that we will not have to scramble to complete our collections or purchase in price gouging secondary markets....this has always been an aspect of the hobby that I dislike.........A real TURN OFF for me....I would like to be able to make purchases at a reasonable pace not having to worry about "retirement"of products

 

[Gebhard]

Tdubel
" As for Forrest, he gets a bad rap by revisionist history. I admire him for the guerilla warfare he led without the aide of formal training. He was a wizard in the saddle. He gets the bad rap as the founder of the KKK, however, if you do your homework, he started it as a southern rights group to protect during "reconstruction", once it turned violent and started its racial overtones, he resigned and disbanded the group. Anyhow, I admire his military prowess and the fact that he fought for what he believed in. To the uninformed, he is generally regarded as an out and out racist "

Great statement.... it really is sad just how little people know about real History . Forrest is in my top 10 Military leaders of all time , I have Ron Tunison's Forrest bust on my desk in the office and John Paul Strains Parkers Crossroads hanging in the war room . No one during the entire CW started as low and went as high in rank as Forrest he was a Natural genius on the battlefield . Maybe First Legion will do an ACW personalities line IMO NBF would be a perfect choice . Gebhard

 

[Jefman]

I would not get too geeked up about Nathan Bedford Forrest. There have been numerous discussions about him on the Civil War Cavalry history boards. Remember Forrest operated in the western theatre where cavalry tended to operate in some very autonomous and independant ways. JEB Stuart gets barbequed for occasionally operating with that type of focus during numerous Eastern theatre campaigns particulary at Gettysburg when he was off galavanting burning the Federal Cavalry depot at Carlisle while Lee's main army languished near Gettysburg operating without its eyes and ears until late 2nd day during the most epic battle of the war. If Forrest had to attack objectives that had strategic value, in coordination with the main armies he may have had to sacrifice some of his success. Now us Confederate Cavalry afficianados have a tendency to romanticize the exploits of some of the Rebel Horsemen particularly Stuart and Forrest but others are just as worthy, just as capable but less showy and less adored by the passings of history. Just an opinion. No doubt Forrest made life difficult for the Union in the west but his prescence can be debated as sometimes formidable often times a nuiscance.But I don't want to hijack this thread as it is a thread with a life of its own for sure.

 

[DCN1898]

Rightly or wrongly, Fort Pillow is also a stain on his record. He was a truly great cavalry commander and there aren't too many saints in uniform.

 

[marco55]

Rightly or wrongly, Fort Pillow is also a stain on his record. He was a truly great cavalry commander and there aren't too many saints in uniform.

Joan of Arc?
Mark

 

[DCN1898]

Joan of Arc?
Mark

I said not too many, didn't say none!

 

[marco55]

Your Right.
Mark

 

[Jefman]

You are dead wrong on your assessment of Bedford Forrest as a great Cavalry commander. Save that conclusion for the less informed. The pre eminent Civil War Cavalry historian in the U.S. is Eric Wittenberg, an attorney in Columbus, Ohio, who concludes the same as I, that Bedford Forrest achieved his successes in the western theatre against 2nd rate Union Cavarly...the junior varsity if you will. Due to Forrest's difficulties with authority and following orders he would have been marginal at best in the eastern theatre no where on par with say a Wade Hampton, Fitzhugh Lee even a Thomas Munford or Lunsford Lomax. Its amazing how these western theatre successes that Forrest achieved get accolades as if his actions were that effective and that strategically important. In an historical context Forrest has been romanticized to a level of cult like status but if one critically analyzes his efforts then you get the distinct impression that operating autonomously ala John Mosby actually was guerrilla warfare and that over time his efforts would prolong the war but in no way shape or form lead to an outright victory in the conflict. This subject has been covered ad nauseum on Eric's site. You should access it and once you read up the data presented your opinions might be a bit swayed.

 

[Gebhard]

I would not get too geeked up about Nathan Bedford Forrest. There have been numerous discussions about him on the Civil War Cavalry history boards. Remember Forrest operated in the western theatre where cavalry tended to operate in some very autonomous and independant ways. JEB Stuart gets barbequed for occasionally operating with that type of focus during numerous Eastern theatre campaigns particulary at Gettysburg when he was off galavanting burning the Federal Cavalry depot at Carlisle while Lee's main army languished near Gettysburg operating without its eyes and ears until late 2nd day during the most epic battle of the war. If Forrest had to attack objectives that had strategic value, in coordination with the main armies he may have had to sacrifice some of his success. Now us Confederate Cavalry afficianados have a tendency to romanticize the exploits of some of the Rebel Horsemen particularly Stuart and Forrest but others are just as worthy, just as capable but less showy and less adored by the passings of history. Just an opinion. No doubt Forrest made life difficult for the Union in the west but his prescence can be debated as sometimes formidable often times a nuiscance.But I don't want to hijack this thread as it is a thread with a life of its own for sure.

Everyone has an opinion and I don't consider your post a hijack , I guess it comes down to what or who you read . But all the same I'll stay "geeked up about NBF " Thanks Best Gebhard

 

[Jefman]

Gebhard...Nothing but respect for your opinion. Trust me. Bedford Forrest is such a compelling and artful personality. He is most worthy of active discussion. I am so gald you brought it up. In fact I hope Tom weighs in with his thoughts but I am just glad that Civil War Cavalry is in such vogue. Really cool not only in the First Legion context but with Britain's and hopefully K&C. It's cool to debate and to correct but mostly it just cool to have a little fun. All the best to you too and all the other Bedford Forrest followers.

 

[Gebhard]

Gebhard...Nothing but reespect for your opinion. Trust me. Bedford Forrest is such a compelling and artful personality. He is most worthy of active discussion. I am so gald you brought it up. In fact I hope Tom weighs in with his thoughts but I am just glad that Civil War Cavalry is in such vogue. Really cool not only in the First Legion context but with Britain's and hopefully K&C. It's cool to debate and to correct but mostly it just cool to have a little fun. All the best to you too and all the other Bedford Forrest followers.

Jefman ,
I can't take credit for bringing Forrest into this thread i was just making a comment about post 154 from Tdubel . I don't follow anyone except the man upstairs no cult worship here just happen to admire Forrest as a fighting man who IMO did pretty good for himself . Best Gebhard

 

[DCN1898]

Whether he was fighting second rate Union Cavalry commanders or not, he was a factor throughout the war. He did very well with the resources that he had and with an independent command. Many lesser leaders would not have done near as well. Also, we are still talking about him.

 

[tdubel]

Whether he was fighting second rate Union Cavalry commanders or not, he was a factor throughout the war. He did very well with the resources that he had and with an independent command. Many lesser leaders would not have done near as well. Also, we are still talking about him.

Gephard and DCN, agree much. I consider him a wizard in the saddle based on my study. I have read the many account's including Erics who consider him great against only second rate. Jefman, I do acknowledge the alternative viewpoint, I just tend to put Forrest in the same class as Jeb and Mosby. I also agree with Hampton being "second" class! I also admire Jeb greatly, he is the supreme calvary commander in my book, one of my ancestors died at Yellow Tavern.

Was Forrest a nuisance to Sherman (I have trouble typing him by name ), yes he was, I believe Sherman outrightedly couldn't stand it when Forrest was near him!

Anyhow, get there firstest with the mostest in all that you do in life and you will be ok.................

TD

 

[joesgis]

Joe,
By George I think you've got it ....I have been politicking for Rome and her Enemies and the Crusaders for a long time now I'm just afraid I'll run out of room and money if they ever do get into these lines Happy Collecting Gebhard

I appreciate any politicking you can provide in regards to Rome and her enemies and/or a full blown Crusader line! I'm sure you could generate far more leverage than many of us combined as you are a super fan indeed ! I enjoy reading the FL threads, which you are always a cheerful participant in. I'm certain many of us enjoy your enthusiasm. I think it's just a matter of time before we are all investing in FL to some degree. I'm really looking forward to the day when I finally place and receive my first order.....maybe AWI.....maybe ACW, or maybe it's best to wait for my deepest interests to manifest themselves in FL's splendor. Can you imagine what FL could do with Romans or Greeks (or both )?!?! That would be special indeed. I would also enjoy some WWII US and British soldiers; that would reel me right in. But for now I think the waiting game is probably the road I will travel because picking up a FL range is a significant financial endeavor (and worth every penny I'm sure). I'm just not one to dabble once I start in on something; at that point it's hook, line and sinker . So I think I will wait until something of my prime interests comes to FL fruition. Happy collecting to you as well and please keep lobbying for FL to produce Romans and her extraordinarily expansive pallet of enemies! I think FL could do it like no other.





Joe

 

[DCN1898]

Gephard and DCN, agree much. I consider him a wizard in the saddle based on my study. I have read the many account's including Erics who consider him great against only second rate. Jefman, I do acknowledge the alternative viewpoint, I just tend to put Forrest in the same class as Jeb and Mosby. I also agree with Hampton being "second" class! I also admire Jeb greatly, he is the supreme calvary commander in my book, one of my ancestors died at Yellow Tavern.

Was Forrest a nuisance to Sherman (I have trouble typing him by name ), yes he was, I believe Sherman outrightedly couldn't stand it when Forrest was near him!

Anyhow, get there firstest with the mostest in all that you do in life and you will be ok.................

TD

For various reasons, my favorite Cavalry commander is Benjamin Grierson, He had a very successful career both during and after the war.He did well on his raid through Mississippi in support of the Siege of Vicksburg.He also did wellagainst Forrest at Tupelo. I don't consider myself pro Union as much as pro Westerner.
I would like to see a figure of Grierson sometime as well as Forrest. I just try not to think of the Horse Soldiers when mentioning Grierson

 

[jazzeum]

Regarding Jeffman's reference to Eric Wittenberg, I have visited it from time to time and if you're interested in cavalry, that's a must read site. He has also written some very well received books. I will try to find his site and post a link to it later.

 

[jazzeum]

Here is the link to Eric's site, Rantings of a Civil War Historian.

 

[marco55]

Here is the link to Eric's site, Rantings of a Civil War Historian.

Thanks Brad.
Mark

 

[jazzeum]

Glad to help.

Here's another one, Civil War Books and Authors, an indispensible site. He reviews or list many books and has links to many other valuable websites.

Another good book review site is H-Net.

This site, Civil War Book Review, is also very good.

I also recommend the Abraham Lincoln Book Shop in Chicago. If you're looking for an out of print or rare Civil War book, this is the place.

They also run virtualbooksigning.net, which hosts interviews with authors on mostly Civil War topics. You can watch these live and they also have an archive of past programs. It's well worth checking out.

 

[Spitfrnd]

I appreciate any politicking you can provide in regards to Rome and her enemies and/or a full blown Crusader line! I'm sure you could generate far more leverage than many of us combined as you are a super fan indeed ! I enjoy reading the FL threads, which you are always a cheerful participant in. I'm certain many of us enjoy your enthusiasm. I think it's just a matter of time before we are all investing in FL to some degree. I'm really looking forward to the day when I finally place and receive my first order.....maybe AWI.....maybe ACW, or maybe it's best to wait for my deepest interests to manifest themselves in FL's splendor. Can you imagine what FL could do with Romans or Greeks (or both )?!?! That would be special indeed. I would also enjoy some WWII US and British soldiers; that would reel me right in. But for now I think the waiting game is probably the road I will travel because picking up a FL range is a significant financial endeavor (and worth every penny I'm sure). I'm just not one to dabble once I start in on something; at that point it's hook, line and sinker . So I think I will wait until something of my prime interests comes to FL fruition. Happy collecting to you as well and please keep lobbying for FL to produce Romans and her extraordinarily expansive pallet of enemies! I think FL could do it like no other.

Joe

FWIW Joe, I have been doing a bit of lobbying for the lads in sandals as well. Of course, my main focus in on getting items for the Peninsula part of the Napoleonic Wars but I have noted many times publicly and privately to Matt how much I would like to see some real Centurians. Let's hope our humble efforts bare some fruit and we see some short swords and rectangular shields from FL someday; soon but not too soon so I get get my NAP troops taken care of properly.